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- When did you write this?
- Maybe, I've been 16 years old.
- So I came home from 15 years.
- When I came home, I was maybe 15 and 1/2 year.
- In the winter that followed, when I came home--
- and I came home, April '45.
- So it has been, maybe, in the winter '45.
- [SPEAKING GERMAN]
- Yeah, thank you very much.
- You didn't understand.
- But--
- Well--
- --you understood--
- --the spirit.
- --the spirit of it.
- For sure.
- Has this been published someplace?
- No.
- I didn't find any publisher for it.
- About publishing?
- I told Edith, too, that I have used the last three--
- 8 years for writing an autobiographic film.
- But it is not only from Theresienstadt.
- A third of it is Theresienstadt, a third is before,
- and a third is after.
- It is not only the experiences there,
- but it is also a very strong conflict
- between the mother and her son, who wants to be an artist.
- And she doesn't support him, because it is--
- you could die from hunger.
- And as we have experienced, to be nearly dying from hunger,
- before, this has been a very, very strong argument for her.
- But this film, I had it--
- I had it accepted from Danish television.
- But they wanted to change so much in it.
- And I hadn't had--
- I couldn't influence it, so that I withdraw it.
- Oh, I see.
- And after that, I have put that into--
- made it into a novel, a book.
- And it with this book, I have been
- working for three years now-- the last three years.
- And it is finished.
- But I still don't find any editor.
- And I think it is also because I tell the things as they are.
- Yes.
- And the Danish editors do not want
- to print a book where not--
- where, also, some Danes are not so good people.
- Because they think that all the Danes are very good people--
- all of them.
- Well, Danes are like people everywhere.
- Oh.
- People want to [INAUDIBLE].
- Yes.
- And I say there's still some racists, some antisemitism,
- also, in Denmark.
- Even if they sustain there's no antisemitism,
- there is antisemitism.
- And this music festival we have had--
- Yes.
- --is the first manifestation, in Danish mediums--
- Yes.
- --in Danish public, where the Danish papers
- are writing something positive, something
- sympathetic from Jews.
- They have done nothing else but criticize them
- for a lot of, lot of time.
- Really?
- Really, really.
- So this is something of a real achievement?
- Yes, it is an achievement, because, now, they
- see in the papers that the Jews sometimes do--
- Something positive?
- --something else than just shooting
- small Palestinian boys.
- And that's what we have been seeing
- in the Danish television, now, for years.
- Yes, of course.
- You promised to show us the newspapers, the picture.
- Oh, yes.
- Yes.
- Yes.
- Yes.
- From the press conference, there's
- a very bad picture of you and a very good of Edith.
- And as I have been cutting in it,
- it is such a strange thing that all what you say
- and what you say and all what I say, or a lot of what I say,
- is in it.
- But my name has fallen out.
- But your name is there.
- And your name is there.
- And I can give you this, because I have another one.
- Oh, wonderful.
- But you can take a copy or you can maybe take a copy and give
- or you can buy it.
- It's Jyllands-Posten.
- It's from today?
- No, it is from Sunday.
- Oh, Sunday's.
- Sunday.
- And it is from Jyllands-Posten.
- [NON-ENGLISH]
- I'll make a copy.
- Of course, I'll make a copy.
- Sure.
- That's very good.
- Yes.
- That's the way to do it.
- OK, wonderful.
- And here is the date of it.
- Yes.
- The review, apparently, was--
- and it doesn't mention any composer's name.
- It doesn't mention you, at all.
- No.
- No performers.
- And I was told it's very critical of this [NON-ENGLISH],,
- this announcer, which--
- Yes.
- --was really not very good.
- He was a piece of shit.
- It was pretty awful.
- [LAUGHTER]
- That's not recorded.
- But it might just as well be.
- Yes.
- Because it wasn't very good.
- He is a friend of mine.
- Yes.
- But he has been in the Danish commercials and--
- how do you call it--
- popular editions--
- Yes.
- --in the television for a long time.
- So he has been--
- It wasn't the kind of person to--
- --infected.
- So he made bad jokes.
- Yes.
- When you were playing serious music,
- sometimes he made bad jokes in between about--
- yes, very bad.
- I've never had such an experience, I must say.
- I've done, already, two live broadcasts
- Yes.
- --of Terezín music.
- Yes.
- I write the script.
- Yes.
- And we get very good and very serious--
- Yes.
- --announcers from the radio.
- Oh, yes.
- And they read very well but exactly what I wrote--
- Yes.
- --nothing more and nothing less.
- And that's how we did it in January.
- But when we broadcast in April, I was very surprised.
- But apparently, he was rather sympathetic to the Terezín
- music.
- Yes.
- But not sympathetic to the Israeli music.
- No.
- With the exception of the [PERSONAL NAME]..
- Yes, but he was--
- he's used to be popular, that everybody has to laugh
- when he says a bad joke.
- So he thought he was in the television,
- again, in these stupid, stupid sendings.
- Well, didn't he-- wasn't it explained to him
- what this music was about?
- Oh, yes.
- And you know something?
- His father came-- was a friend of my mother and my stepfather.
- So I knew his father.
- And his father was a Jew, who, in '45, committed suicide.
- And he didn't know his father.
- So when I told him--
- I'm 10 years older than he is-- that I--
- 15 years older--
- I have known your father.
- He was almost crying.
- So he is a very--
- Sensitive person.
- --sensitive person.
- But he was so stupid that day.
- Now, tell me, what do you have in this red book?
- I want you to write in it.
- Oh, to write in it.
- That's my guest book.
- I want you to write-- and you, too.
- That's my guest book.
- Will you do that, immediately?
- Yeah.
- Because I--
- The interview first.
- Yes.
- Now, you might like them to see.
- I tell you what, whilst Edith is away,
- can we put together whatever you've
- prepared for me in photocopies, so I don't forget anything?
- Yes.
- That would be fantastic.
- So this, you give to Edith.
- Edith--
- I'll give her a copy of [INAUDIBLE]..
- Yes.
- You must promise that.
- Yes.
- Let me ask you, also, Paul--
- Yes.
- --would you be interested--
- Yes.
- --if copies of some of these things
- would be, in Beit Terezín, in the kibbutz.
- Yes.
- Obviously, they're very eager for anything--
- Yes.
- --related.
- And it doesn't matter--
- You can give them--
- --from the kibbutz or if it's after--
- Yes.
- --they will acknowledge it.
- I want you to--
- a collection in the proper way.
- Yes.
- I want you to have my poems, my poetry, or course.
- Yes, for sure.
- One-- well, just take it.
- I just wanted to show that's a Tivoli car boy.
- I was in the Tivoli Garden.
- Looked like that.
- That's in [INAUDIBLE] office tower.
- How it is today?
- In the same uniforms.
- Yeah, we have to come in the summer--
- Yes.
- --when it's open.
- Just to show you.
- Yeah.
- And you got-- that is the interview.
- Yes.
- So I don't have to mention this.
- No.
- No, This is very normal.
- This is very normal.
- This is very normal.
- Because there, you have all the--
- No, that's very normal.
- Because, you said, you didn't know how many--
- Well, I have looked at it.
- And I don't remember all of those facts in my head.
- But I'm trying to remember what's in the book.
- No, you just had to remember that it is here, in here.
- For sure.
- So that you can always find it there.
- Yeah.
- Then, I want you to--
- That I would like.
- Yes.
- And I would like you very much to have it.
- Translate it to Hebrew--
- Yes.
- --and to English.
- Yes.
- And to make music to it.
- I want-- and then
- I'll think about it.
- Because I wouldn't give it, straightaway.
- I'll think about which composers--
- Yes.
- --and who would be--
- And when it has to be sung--
- Yes.
- --I think it should be sung by a man.
- OK.
- Because it is very strange.
- I had a feeling--
- Yes.
- --and I'll have to think about it
- more when I really understand every word-- that it
- would be best to do it with a small ensemble of instruments.
- Yes.
- Not just piano.
- Not just piano, no.
- Something like--
- Because it's dramatic.
- --some strings and piano and winds and percussion.
- Yes.
- Because it goes up to a fortissimo, here.
- Yes.
- Where he has this fantasy of attacking, of revolting.
- Yeah.
- And then it goes down in the disillusion,
- in disappointment, at last.
- Yeah.
- Yeah.
- OK.
- I'll think about it, very carefully.
- Good.
- And I have one for Edith that I want to sign, to Edith.
- I could sign that, too.
- Fine.
- Yes?
- Sure.
- And you may keep it.
- Then I'll write Paul Rabinowitz.
- Because that's my name.
- And then Sanford, OK?
- Sanford was the name of my first wife.
- And when they started here, it was about after '67--
- I think.
- Yes, after '67, there came a wave of antisemitism
- in Danish, in Denmark, because the Israelis won the war.
- And they started to send letter bombs.
- For instance, Melchior, the Rabbi Melchior
- got a letter bomb.
- I see.
- And I was called Rabinowitz, I thought, better take that name
- away from the telephone book and be called Sanford.
- So that's why.
- Because my little daughter, of two years,
- she went, every morning, to get me the post.
- And I thought, if I got a letter--
- Of course.
- --with a bomb, and my--
- This was your lovely daughter, who I saw?
- Yes.
- Yes.
- When she was two or three years old.
- Yeah, she's a beautiful girl.
- Yes, she is.
- So that you get.
- And "with heartily regards."
- I can give you--
- I must put regards, too.
- Rabinowitz?
- Oh, I'm not used to write "Rabinowitz" anymore.
- I have to think, what's my name?
- OK.
- OK.
- And then, do you have a copy of the original,
- of the little poem, [NON-ENGLISH]??
- Yes, I have.
- I have.
- I have it here.
- And if it's not asking too much, I'm so greedy, always,
- on such occasions, but it's important,
- the text of the Danish story.
- Because that should be, also, if you like, translated.
- Yes.
- Yes.
- Yes.
- Yes.
- Yes.
- Oh, you wanted to translate it from Danish to English,
- you could do that.
- Oh, sure, that's not a problem.
- That's not a problem.
- We can have it from Danish to English and Danish to Hebrew.
- I see.
- Rabinowitz.
- That's one.
- And I can tell you that anything--
- I can assure you, that anything that
- would be done, whether it's quoted by me
- or whatever, I would always do it only with your written
- authorization.
- Yeah.
- OK.
- That's very important.
- Don't think that it's funny that when I got this film, Der Juden
- schenkt den Führer eine Stadt, I had
- to pay the Bundesarchiv in Koblenz to get it.
- And why are we giving the Germans money for a film
- that they have made in Terezín?
- Well, it's for that reason that Yad Vashem
- asks for nothing but credit, recognition, acknowledgment
- of anything which is actually Nazi-produced material.
- Yes.
- They say nothing of Nazi material can be copyrighted.
- But why do the Germans have the copyright from this film?
- Well?
- Well, it's grotesque.
- Of course, it's grotesque.
- Because they had the film made.
- In fact, now that you talk about it,
- I think that they told me, in Yad Vashem,
- that the Germans had wanted it.
- And they said nothing doing.
- I'm not sure.
- Oh, the Germans wanted to pay Yad Vashem?
- No, I think they also wanted some money.
- Yes?
- Maybe not.
- Maybe I don't remember.
- I had to pay for it, at least.
- It's strange, isn't it?
- Yeah.
- So.
- Oh, you wanted-- yes.
- Yeah, I want the story.
- I think the story should be good.
- Yes.
- OK.
- You didn't understand it, but you think it's good.
- All right.
- It has my tentative approval.
- Yes.
- This poet, is a small poem, [NON-ENGLISH]..
- Yes.
- [NON-ENGLISH],, that could be sung by a woman.
- Maybe your wife and only piano, because it's--
- but the other thing should be--
- Look, this is another whole genre of Terezín material,
- which is poetry from the camp--
- Yes.
- --set to music by mostly living composers.
- Yes.
- Yes.
- Yes.
- And then, of course, reminiscences and poetry
- and so on written afterwards--
- Yes.
- --relating to it.
- That's also another thing.
- I mean until now, I'm very busy just with the music that
- was composed there.
- Good.
- You know?
- But anyhow, I still have this book.
- I hope that I could get it edited, somewhere.
- Yeah.
- I tell you, it's very hard, I think.
- Because there is so much material, now.
- Yes.
- And so many have been writing.
- And now, there's this saying, there's
- no business like Shoah business.
- No.
- Instead of show business.
- Yes.
- And so it's very difficult. And very often,
- excellent, wonderful things--
- Yes.
- --struggle just to get--
- There is a lady that I hope to meet in Prague.
- Yes.
- She was a youngster there.
- And her father wrote a book called--
- I mentioned it to you--
- God Came to Terezín and Saw That it was Bad.
- And she made the drawings, which go with that book.
- She's trying, still unsuccessfully,
- to find a publisher.
- Yes.
- She is called [NON-ENGLISH],
- That was the name?
- In Yad Vashem?
- No.
- You can-- I sent this.
- Yad Vashem has my poem.
- I know.
- We stayed in--
- Yes.
- --rooms next to each other in the hotel.
- This was an answer when, I, in '75, sent them my poem.
- And then I asked them for an artist, designing artists.
- Yes.
- I knew who was still living in Prague at that time.
- And I wanted to send her my poem, too.
- Because, in some way, I wanted her
- to have the poem, because she has
- made a drawing just of that.
- What was her name?
- And that's her name, Burusova.
- Let me look.
- I have my cards, here.
- And she made a drawing, which was exactly
- describing the situation that I am describing in my poetry.
- I have it, here, too.
- I have the book, here.
- Yes.
- This is not my book.
- It is a Copenhagen. But there is a drawing.
- [TELEPHONE]
- Yeah, hello?
- [NON-ENGLISH]
- Helga Hoskova.
- [NON-ENGLISH]
- [CROSS TALKING]
- [NON-ENGLISH]
- No, sorry.
- [INTERPOSING VOICES]
- --telephone number, I would ask you to call her.
- I know the address, so you should be able to--
- [NON-ENGLISH]
- See if she has room for me.
- [NON-ENGLISH]
- And if not, to find me a place, even an inexpensive hotel,
- just to get started.
- [NON-ENGLISH]
- [INTERPOSING VOICES]
- Just so I have some idea.
- [NON-ENGLISH]
- Because I don't know the flight that comes into [INAUDIBLE]..
- [NON-ENGLISH]
- For the night or something.
- Right.
- I would ask you.
- This is my wife.
- Yes.
- [NON-ENGLISH] No?
- OK.
- Would you care for or you don't-- you wouldn't eat
- a piece of bread with salmon.
- I'm a vegetarian besides being kosher.
- I'm [NON-ENGLISH].
- Hey hey, [NON-ENGLISH].
- He's a vegetarian besides being kosher.
- But you would eat it.
- Yes.
- Good.
- And I'll keep you company, very happily.
- And I'll drink a glass of juice and eat a tomato or something
- like that.
- OK.
- OK.
- I have a confession to make.
- [INTERPOSING VOICES]
- And that's--
- In Terezín?
- Yeah.
- [INTERPOSING VOICES]
- [NON-ENGLISH].
- We went.
- We wanted to go there.
- [INTERPOSING VOICES]
- And we, by mistake, got onto a fast train.
- Yeah.
- Just do you eat cheese?
- Well, I only eat kosher cheese.
- [NON-ENGLISH], kosher.
- Don't worry about what I eat.
- [NON-ENGLISH]
- I'll have a few raw vegetables, fruit, raw vegetables.
- OK.
- She shouldn't do anything special.
- OK.
- OK.
- OK.
- [NON-ENGLISH]
- [INTERPOSING VOICES]
- [NON-ENGLISH] Right?
- I hope so.
- Yeah.
- I would ask.
- I'll give you, actually, several names for that.
- [NON-ENGLISH]
- So Sylvie--
- [NON-ENGLISH].
- Bit-- no.
- And I think it's [NON-ENGLISH],, something like that.
- Yeah.
- Number seven.
- It's near the-- it's near the stop of the [NON-ENGLISH]
- mural.
- I'm pretty certain that that's--
- and so it should be in the form of-- actually--
- [INTERPOSING VOICES]
- Wait.
- But I have--
- [NON-ENGLISH]
- No, I have, actually-- wait a minute.
- I can give, also, the telephone and the name--
- that's even better--
- of her father's second husband.
- Her father's divorced, and she has still the mother alive.
- But the father has married a younger woman--
- very, very nice.
- This is a picture, not that one from her, but--
- I show that, always, in my lectures.
- Yeah.
- This is the situation I have in my poem.
- Yeah.
- That is the same situation.
- And I saw a very nice drawing from this lady.
- So that's why I wanted to send my poem to her.
- And they said that they couldn't give me [NON-ENGLISH]..
- Yeah.
- They couldn't give me--
- It's not the name of the lady that I have.
- No.
- No.
- But anyhow, then I found her, all the same,
- through the Czech embassy.
- Yes.
- And sent it down.
- Tell me, when people came--
- when you came to go in the line for soup,
- you brought your own pot?
- Yes.
- We had a pot.
- So I have a photograph.
- Yes.
- I don't have it here.
- I have it over, just in my suitcase.
- From many of the small fragments,
- from the film, which never--
- Yeah.
- --they just cut it apart.
- Yes.
- One of them is a young woman and another woman standing next
- to her.
- And they're walking through the middle of the street.
- And they have their pots.
- Yes.
- So I always showed that photograph.
- And then I showed that drawing.
- Oh, good, good, good.
- Yeah.
- I should like to have that, too.
- But anyhow, we are going to see that, the film.
- Yes, of course.
- Here is her-- now, she didn't write to me.
- I don't know why.
- But she can't be mad at me, because I was so nice to her.
- And so I don't know.
- She is a lovely, lovely person.
- And that's actually, strictly speaking, the stepmother.
- [INAUDIBLE]
- Yeah.
- [INAUDIBLE]
- So that's doctor-- all of these doctors-- everything
- is appropriate.
- And--
- But anyhow, the drawings, we see them.
- They are all in the Museum of Prague.
- There are a lot of drawings.
- Right.
- Telephone--
- 2-1-6--
- 2-1-6--
- --1-7-4--
- --1-7-4--
- --6-9.
- --6-9.
- And she is?
- Itarska.
- Sylvie's Itarska.
- She is living in [PLACE NAME].
- [PLACE NAME]
- In [PLACE NAME].
- And she is Sylvie's?
- Ah, but here is another address.
- That's home.
- That must be work.
- So I don't know, maybe that's work telephone or whatever.
- So.
- [INAUDIBLE]
- Yeah, so she's Sylvie's father's wife.
- She has a little boy named Hunter.
- A little boy named Hunter.
- Yeah.
- And the other thing--
- [NON-ENGLISH]
- [NON-ENGLISH]
- Yeah.
- Ask Sylvie if David can stay with her.
- If not, please find a hotel starting--
- I'm sure I'll be there Sunday night.
- That is 25?
- Sunday evening, March 25.
- Only for a few days, then I'll see.
- Because maybe.
- But hopefully, she will.
- OK, is that clear?
- Yeah.
- And then I'll see?
- And then I'll see.
- And then I'll see.
- But I hope that I can stay with her.
- Now, I'll give you the number where she could call me, just
- to get a message, in Hamburg.
- Then I don't just sort of come stamp, out of the blue.
- She didn't get my message when I came last time.
- And I arrived at midnight, because the plane didn't land.
- We went to Munich.
- And we took a bus, for seven, eight hours.
- And then by the time I got there, I called.
- And she hadn't gotten my message,
- as they said she would.
- And here, it's freezing cold, midnight, in Prague,
- and she's not home.
- So I didn't know what to do.
- So I went there.
- Nobody home.
- Now, it's 1:00 in the morning.
- And I'm thinking, you know, you're an adult person.
- How stupid are you?
- And what are you going to do?
- But then she came driving with her friend.
- And they had been moving some things, because she
- was painting at the time.
- So I just want to do [INAUDIBLE],,
- but I don't see [INAUDIBLE].
- You want a little more tea?
- No, thanks.
- No, thanks.
- I'll have a little.
- OK.
- Yeah.
- And I'll take-- when I'm there, after your recording,
- so then we'll go to see Elena, my friend.
- Oh, you'll like her.
- That's right.
- But no, no, it's true.
- But if you need a place to practice,
- she should maybe do it.
- I don't have Reinhardt's in here.
- Where is it?
- Oh, here it is.
- Please have something--
- Want another piece?
- Help yourself.
- --a message--
- OK.
- --for me at Reinhard Voit.
- He's a musicologist in Hamburg.
- And the number is 0-9 and then 4-0 and some--
- [NON-ENGLISH]
- 0-9-4-0, and the number itself is 4-3-9-6-4-0-7.
- He'll know where I'm staying.
- This one.
- This is for you, too.
- Oh, great, yeah.
- Yeah.
- OK?
- Now, let me tell you, also, who could maybe
- help you to find a piano.
- Ask to find a piano to--
- I assume he has a piano, but it's not playable.
- She should fix it.
- It's an antique.
- It's incredible.
- Yeah.
- Well, it sounds terrible.
- But the box is very old.
- But so, for this, you should call--
- you could ask Helena.
- I think Helena, you could ask.
- And then Turbanova.
- And you have it over there.
- But then also ask in the [NON-ENGLISH],,
- in the [NON-ENGLISH] Right?
- Yeah.
- [NON-ENGLISH]
- [NON-ENGLISH]
- [NON-ENGLISH]
- So that would be Alena.
- Alena-- I can't write with this--
- Yungerova or Julianna.
- She's the new actual director.
- Topercher--
- Topercherlova.
- She's the director.
- But Alena--
- [INTERPOSING VOICES]
- They both know me.
- They both know me.
- And I take them flowers.
- And we just know each other.
- They're my good friends.
- She's like a real daughter, Alena.
- She's really [NON-ENGLISH] and goes around with [NON-ENGLISH]..
- Every Czech lady in Prague goes with [NON-ENGLISH]..
- Splendid.
- And Julianne is much younger.
- But they should certainly be able, I'm sure.
- I'm sure.
- I see, have you--
- Edith did and now I do.
- Oh, OK.
- Directly the number?
- Oh, sorry, of course.
- So 2-3-1-2-5-3-5 or 2-3-1-2-4-0-9, in case,
- for any reason, of some change, the address is, of course,
- [NON-ENGLISH]--
- [NON-ENGLISH].
- [NON-ENGLISH] 13.
- And it's just around the corner from the [NON-ENGLISH] Shul.
- You know, where the [NON-ENGLISH] square is?
- I know that [INAUDIBLE].
- And they have piano, right, [INAUDIBLE]..
- It's beautiful.
- Everyone from the street can see you playing the piano.
- Phone?
- I wrote it.
- These are the telephones.
- OK?
- OK.
- Thank you.
- So in life, we try to help each other.
- Yeah.
- This is fantastic that Edith is going to record, again,
- for the radio in Prague.
- Oh, it's fantastic.
- After all these years.
- And hopefully, I'll be there to turn the pages.
- Anyway, I have to go to [INAUDIBLE] about all
- the other things.
- Yeah.
- Well, I will call him immediately.
- Yeah.
- Well, he's a very, very nice fellow.
- And I'm sure that we'll make, somehow,
- an evening of all of the musician people
- that I know while you're there.
- Yeah?
- Yeah, we'll make it Sylvie's house or someplace.
- Good.
- A violinist and this one and that one--
- now, I have to put something--
- No.
- Well, I want to ask you something.
- Yeah.
- Other hand, I tried to call--
- Copenhagen.
- --Copenhagen.
- Yes.
- But he was not in and I spoke only to his wife.
- Yeah.
- Could you ask him to take the tape of my recording?
- Oh, that's right, to ask for it.
- Yes.
- Ask for it.
- Yeah.
- [INAUDIBLE]
- We should call it, the Munich notes.
- Do you know when it is going to be sent?
- Do you know it?
- We don't know.
- No.
- They may not know themselves, yet.
- Yes.
- Very often, they wait.
- And they have usually way ahead of time.
- What you could do is to ask the radio to take a tape
- and send you a tape.
- Yes.
- They ask that, from the festival--
- Yes.
- --an official letter we sent requesting it.
- And then he would send it.
- Yes.
- Well, it's a little strange.
- So that he doesn't have to do it.
- The radio will do it and send.
- Yeah.
- Yeah.
- But he wanted a letter from the festival asking it.
- I see, see.
- It was a little strange.
- Because the girl who did the interview--
- Yes.
- --with us is going to send it to Edith, right away, and to me,
- too.
- Yes.
- Anyway, that's what he asked.
- She has sent to me, already, the interview.
- She sent it to you?
- Yes.
- Because she interviewed me, too.
- Oh, the same girl?
- Yes, the same girl, with--
- the same girl.
- No, no, it's a different girl.
- From the press conference?
- No, no, no, no, no, no.
- This is another girl, a very nice young girl,
- who works for the radio [CROSS TALK]
- I see.
- I see.
- You did an interview that we did after the recording.
- I see now.
- We finished the recording.
- And then Edith had to go upstairs for two kilometers--
- Yeah.
- Yeah.
- Yes.
- --to a little place.
- Yeah.
- And then we sat and made quite a nice intelligent--
- [NON-ENGLISH]
- Ah, Edith.
- And she sent you--
- She would do it.
- But he asked to do it, formally.
- So let's see, call--
- Call?
- Well, that last number.
- For Avraham?
- Yeah, OK.
- I'll ask, because I'm seeing Anna tonight.
- Ask Anna, now to have Avraham, Kopenhaken.
- That's so funny.
- Funny, but it's with a K, Kopenhaken, K.
- Oh, I wrote it, yeah.
- Kopenhaken.
- Another Copenhagen. Write--
- That's--
- --to radio the question Edith may send.
- OK.
- Now, remind me again, the producer was?
- Peter Handke.
- Peter Handke.
- Peter Handke.
- Yeah.
- The Swiss.
- And give her my address, also.
- Right.
- [INAUDIBLE]
- Right.
- Yes, I should have your address, too.
- [NON-ENGLISH] over-- what's the apartment number?
- What?
- The apartment number.
- The apartment number?
- 22
- [INAUDIBLE]
- [INAUDIBLE] 9-3-7-1-4.
- OK.
- I'll try to--
- This is when [INAUDIBLE]
- Oh, sure.
- Because I think it was on--
- [INAUDIBLE]
- --the best I've gotten so far.
- Each time, you say that.
- No.
- No?
- When you recorded the room, for the radio,
- after you did in [NON-ENGLISH],, you said,
- it's the best [INAUDIBLE] that you could do.
- Of course not.
- I said it was better.
- It was better.
- Today and yesterday, I practiced the [INAUDIBLE]..
- And I just don't know what to think.
- I have to start playing every evening.
- I cannot do it.
- I cannot get it to the point where I know it's perfect every
- single time.
- There something just send you--
- No.
- I feel like--
- No.
- No.
- But it has to be a minimum level of being professional.
- You see, now--
- And I go kaput.
- You'll see how terrible I play with this [INAUDIBLE]..
- OK.
- But I know how you can also do it.
- And I can't do it the way I really want to in the tempo.
- I mean I can't do it.
- No, I also can do it only some time.
- OK, but I don't see now to do whatever you want to do.
- I don't.
- I really don't.
- I know things that I can do really well.
- Well, maybe do, you know, whatever that's a conscience,
- because you don't practice.
- Well, you know, maybe, [INAUDIBLE]..
- It is much [INAUDIBLE]
- So.
- So.
- Thank you.
- A few words.
- Good.
- Even wrote a few words.
- And I said, a little bit more clean and a little bit more--
- perhaps we can put this white part.
- Good.
- And now, I'll show you first the extra pieces
- from the propaganda film
- Good.
- Now what this is, I guess can--
- [AUDIO OUT]
- OK.
- Yes, I remember one great music festival evening,
- in Terezín, just like the festival we had, here, last
- Sunday.
- It was a lot of different folklore performances
- and entertainments.
- And that was an evening where all the nations, represented
- in Terezin, in folks' costume, were dancing and singing.
- And the Czechs, with their costumes,
- were singing in Czech.
- And the Austrians were singing in German.
- And the Germans, in Germany, from the different parts,
- and the Holland people were singing, also.
- And it was mostly children.
- And also, the Danish girls performed a dance and singing
- a song, which was arranged in a girls' or children's choir.
- And the song they sang was [SINGING IN DANISH]..
- And that was a modern and folks' tune, like Schlager.
- And it means, you get so happy when the sun is shining.
- Then you forget all your needs and sorrows and longings.
- And this song was--
- [NON-ENGLISH]
- In this [NON-ENGLISH]
- [NON-ENGLISH]
- [NON-ENGLISH]
- [NON-ENGLISH]
- Inside.
- Inside.
- And it was with all these costumes on from each country.
- And I remember this song--
- Yeah.
- --where my comrades from the secret school--
- we had a secret Danish school--
- we were singing this song.
- And it was-- that's one of these Schlagers
- that were very popular in Copenhagen or in Denmark
- during the war.
- You get so happy, you--
- [SINGING IN GERMAN]
- Yeah.
- [SINGING IN GERMAN] It's really touching.
- Oh, thank you.
- It was also said that there were people
- who were paying two rations of bread,
- two normal rations of bread, to get a ticket
- to an evening like that.
- So they really rushed into it, people, to get entertainment.
- There is one poster, I've seen.
- It was called the [NON-ENGLISH].
- And they're dressed in a kind of Bohemian costume
- and all of that.
- I wonder if they actually were a choir which
- specializes in folk music?
- Yes.
- I wonder--
- That was--
- Maybe they were involved.
- Yes.
- I'm sure they were.
- Because it was folk music.
- And--
- After a concert, they usually let you pay at the door.
- No, but how to get tickets?
- You didn't pay.
- You could-- but to get tickets, you
- must know somebody, who knew somebody, who knew somebody.
- And when they heard about that, I
- think that some of the tickets were sold on the black market.
- Can you remember something about--
- And I can also remember--
- Yes.
- --that at this occasion was also sung a "Yiddishe Momme"
- by somebody.
- And then my mother told me this is a very famous one.
- But I don't know who it is.
- Can you say a few words about, on the occasion
- when you played in the coffeehouse, of how
- you remember the people were?
- Were they old people?
- Were they young people, anything?
- Yes.
- They usually sat very still--
- sat very still.
- Mostly old people.
- Yes, mostly old people.
- And then, in front of them, they had this so-called coffee.
- And they had got the tickets.
- Also, there you had to get tickets through somebody,
- who knew somebody.
- But they usually sat there, very quiet, very quiet.
- And when I was in Terezín--
- [AUDIO OUT]
Overview
- Interviewee
- Paul Rabinowitz
- Date
-
interview:
1990 March 15
- Geography
-
creation:
Copenhagen (Denmark)
- Credit Line
- United States Holocaust Memorial Museum Collection, Gift of Emilie Berendsen Bloch, Benjamin Bloch, and Ariel Bloch
Physical Details
- Language
- English
- Extent
-
2 sound cassettes.
Rights & Restrictions
- Conditions on Access
- There are no known restrictions on access to this material.
- Conditions on Use
- No restrictions on use
Keywords & Subjects
- Personal Name
- Rabinowitz, Paul.
Administrative Notes
- Legal Status
- Permanent Collection
- Provenance
- Emilie Berendsen Bloch, Benjamin Bloch, and Ariel Bloch donated the archive of Professor David Bloch to the United States Holocaust Memorial Museum in 2012.
- Funding Note
- The cataloging of this oral history interview has been supported by a grant from the Conference on Jewish Material Claims Against Germany.
- Special Collection
-
The Jeff and Toby Herr Oral History Archive
- Record last modified:
- 2023-11-16 09:37:22
- This page:
- https://collections.ushmm.org/search/catalog/irn558985
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Also in Professor David Bloch collection
Archive of Professor David Bloch, musicologist, founder and director of the Terezin Music Memorial Project, and Israeli institute devoted to the documentation and study of music and music making at the Theresienstadt concentration camp in the former Czechoslovakia and at other localities under German occupation during the Second World War.
Cigarette case
Object
Oral history interview with Ulrich E. Simon
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Oral history interview with Alexander Singer
Oral History
Oral history interview with Elsa Deutsch
Oral History
Oral history interview with Pavel Fuchs
Oral History
Oral history interview with Willi Groag
Oral History
Oral history interview with George Hartman
Oral History
Oral history interview with Tomas Lenda
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Oral history interview with Martin Roman
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Oral history interview with Margit Silberfeld
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Oral history interview with Georg Steiner
Oral History
Oral history interview with Max Dauber
Oral History
Oral history interview with Paul Kling
Oral History
Oral history interview with Gertrude Solarova
Oral History
Oral history interview with Avivva Bar-on
Oral History
Oral history interview with Tomas Mandel
Oral History
Oral history interview with Yosef Klein
Oral History
Oral history interview with Shoshana Heyd
Oral History
Oral history interview with Arieh Zemer
Oral History
Oral history interview with Michael Flack
Oral History
Oral history interview with Manka Alterova
Oral History
Oral history interview with Tomi Spencer
Oral History
Oral history interview with Ruth Elias
Oral History
Oral history interview with Robert Kolban
Oral History
Oral history interview with Uri Bas and Kobi Luria
Oral History
Uri Bas discusses his musical family; the beginning of the war; being sent to the Terezin ghetto on one of the first transports when he was 13 years old; playing the violin and even continuing music lessons in the ghetto, especially harmony; hearing the music in Terezin played in different venues; a song that stayed with him over the years which is a ballad about a pirate [he sings some of it in Czech and reads his translation in Hebrew]; the music in evenings in the ghetto beginning at the end of 1942 to 1943 and which was dedicated to performances and musical entertainment, including cabaret evenings; and being sent to Auschwitz in the fall of 1944, when he was 16 years old.