Oral history interview with Ala Danziger

Oral History | Digitized | Accession Number: 1991.A.0112.3 | RG Number: RG-50.045.0003

: My name is Ala.
: My name is Ala Torenheim Danziger.
: I was born in Bedzin, Poland, in a very lovely city,
: beautiful Jewish people.
: I remember when I was six years old,
: it was so beautiful in our home.
: We are very Orthodox people.
: I had seven sisters and one brother.
: Oh.
: I remember holidays or Saturdays.
: My mother, our housekeeper, we used to cook so much.
: When I used to go out and play with the children
: outside in the yard, I used to tell them all the time,
: you know, the aroma smells so good,
: I can tell you exactly what my mother is cooking right now.
: It was so beautiful.
: My grandmother used to come Friday night, my aunts.
: Most of the time, we seen the family, the cousins and aunts,
: Saturday after this big lunch, what we had.
: [SIGHS] One day I said to my father, Daddy,
: I would like so much to go to the shul with you.
: Like I mentioned before, we were very Orthodox people.
: We had a Sefer Torah in our house, and my daddy studies.
: My daddy used to say to me, Ala, you know, girls
: are not allowed to go there.
: And I said, just let me go with you.
: This was on a Saturday.
: And the last minute, Daddy said, OK.
: I'll let you go with you, and you're
: going to carry my tallis and tefillin in the little velvet
: bag.
: I was so excited.
: I went to my mother, and I said, Mother, would you give me
: some nice little dresses for my little sisters,
: for my other sisters.
: So she dressed me up, and I carried that little bag.
: I was holding hands with my father, going to the shul.
: By the time we went to the shul, we got there,
: my father kissed me on my head and he said, thank you,
: darling.
: God bless you.
: Now you know how to go home.
: Go across the street, straight ahead, and go home.
: Well, I was dancing and singing on the street.
: I was such a happy girl.
: And I was so proud of it, just carrying that little tallis
: for my father.
: My father used to bring all these, the boys, the Hasidim
: boys, you know, from the--
: oh, I can't think of it--
: for luncheons or for dinners or for the holidays.
: They were from out of town all the time.
: And we always-- our door was always open for everybody.
: But those are the people, Daddy used
: to bring them to our house.
: And I remember when they used to walk in.
: They were having those little payos.
: And we had seven girls.
: They walked in with their head down like this,
: looking at every one of us.
: And they turned their heads.
: They didn't expect seven girls there.
: They expected probably seven boys, but not seven girls.
: But anyway, they had dinner with us.
: We had the [INAUDIBLE] Malkah.
: We were singing zmires.
: It was so beautiful.
: But then the war started.
: And my brother, Mojsio, our only brother, he
: was taken, in 1940, to the concentration camp.
: When did you first know that things were changing?
: [SIGHS] It was on a Saturday night,
: but I don't remember exactly the month.
: We heard a lot of commotion in the kitchen, a lot of noise.
: And we looked out the window, and we could see a lot of--
: the sky was so red and just like fire.
: You know?
: But my mother didn't let us go to the window.
: And she used to say to us, don't worry.
: Just go back to sleep.
: So we went back to bed, but we couldn't go to sleep.
: We were so anxious to find out what was going on.
: We knew it was something wrong, but we didn't know exactly.
: Must have been around maybe 1 o'clock
: in the morning, 12:30, 1 o'clock in the morning.
: Then we heard loudspeakers and things like that.
: Then it didn't really take long, maybe weeks later, they
: burst into our home and look for boys,
: with the machine guns and kicking and hollering,
: and breaking down a lot of things.
: And that was the time they took my brother, my only brother.
: Our house wasn't the same anymore.
: My parents', my sisters' lives wasn't the same thing anymore.
: I mean, it was the biggest loss in our family,
: what could happen to us.
: [SIGHS]
: Then after that--
: What did you think was happening to your brother?
: My brother?
: When they took my brother, my--
: they told him that they're taking him to work.
: And as far as I know, and as far as I remember,
: he was supposed to go to work and come right back.
: But we never seen our brother anymore.
: I don't remember all the details about my brother,
: really, to be honest with you.
: I was such a young girl then.
: I don't remember.
: The only thing I do remember, it was a terrible horror.
: Everybody was crying and scared.
: And we never saw our brother again.
: But later on we found out that they took him
: to the concentration camp.
: Later on we found out that he was sent to Auschwitz.
: [SIGHS] It was just horrible.
: Then we-- we had some food in our house,
: but they announced that, all the time on the loudspeaker,
: there's certain days you can go on the streets
: and buy certain food.
: And you can go out, and certain times you have to be at home.
: Otherwise, if you would be in a different time
: or different hour, they will really kill you or pick you
: up or whatever.
: So we didn't have too much food in the house.
: My sister tried to go out and buy some bread
: to go to the bakery and stay in the line there.
: She never came back.
: That was Ruzia, my oldest sister.
: Then Hanka, when they came in the second time, the Germans,
: they broke down everything.
: They looked in the closets, under the beds, everywhere.
: And they took my other sister, Hanka away from us.
: A few days later--
: like I said, we didn't have any food anymore in the house.
: My mother was afraid to send my other sisters out
: because they looked big.
: They were more than 18 years old.
: And she was afraid if they're going to go,
: they're going to pick them up.
: So I volunteered.
: I volunteered to go, to bring some groceries.
: And I didn't believe somebody is going to even look at me.
: I was only 10 years old.
: I didn't believe they're going to even--
: that was the first time I was out from my house by myself.
: But my mother said to me, Ala, I'm so scared for you to go.
: And I kept telling her, don't be afraid.
: I'm going to be all right.
: And I remember like now, I was wearing my navy
: blue skirt, pleated, with my top with a marine color
: and white little stockings.
: And my mother said to me, you like chocolate eclairs so much.
: Why don't you ask, when you're going
: to go to Gele Ritzkeler that was the lady's name in Bedzin--
: go ahead and buy yourself two of them.
: I was so pleased.
: I was so happy.
: But I didn't know about the problem really.
: I knew I lost my brother.
: I knew I lost my sister.
: And I hated it.
: But inside, really, I didn't understand what it was or why,
: why they did all that.
: Why is it coming to us?
: What did we do?
: We didn't deserve anything like this.
: [SIGHS] So with my mother's and father's blessings,
: I went to Gele Ritzkeler, and I picked up the groceries.
: A lot of things I forgot to ask her, what my mother did,
: but she gave it to me.
: I was so pleased.
: I said I'm going to bring some food to the house.
: We didn't have a slice of bread anymore in the house, nothing.
: Going back home, when I left--
: oh, yeah.
: So I ask her about the chocolate eclairs.
: And she said, honey, I am so sorry,
: but I don't have any chocolate eclairs.
: We didn't bake any eclairs in a long time.
: Nobody is buying them.
: But I tell you what.
: I'm going to give you some cookies.
: She said, you will?
: So she gave me a bag of cookies.
: Well, I was carrying those packages
: and carrying those cookies and eating them on the street.
: I didn't see anything.
: I mean, the cookies and the groceries
: meant so much to me, just to bring the food home
: to my family.
: I saw a lot of people on the street
: at the same time, coming and walking and everything.
: And then I heard voices.
: [GERMAN]
: Freeze.
: But I didn't pay any attention.
: I didn't know that they were talking to me.
: Then they were screaming.
: I could hear the tongues driving the buses.
: [GERMAN], or I'll kill you.
: And I've been still walking with those packages
: and eating the cookies.
: Then I turned around from all the people.
: I found out I was on the street by myself.
: It looked to me as if they all disappeared
: or they were hiding.
: I was by myself.
: I started walking faster and faster.
: I must have been maybe two or two and a half blocks away
: from my home.
: And by that time, on the loudspeaker,
: I heard that noise, if I don't stop they're going to kill me.
: And three police officers, I think they were SS people.
: I don't know.
: They came in front of me.
: And they stopped me with the machine guns and the guns
: in the hands.
: And I dropped my packages on the street.
: The first thing they ask me, why I don't wear my Jewish star.
: And then they said, you're Jewish.
: I was trembling.
: I couldn't answer.
: They made me picked up those packages.
: And I walked with them maybe a half a mile,
: crying I want to go home to my mother.
: I wanted to go home.
: It was a big truck with a lot of people.
: But at that time, they took my groceries away,
: and they threw me in.
: I'll never forget this day.
: Was a lot of people there with long beards, women.
: I was just a child, screaming.
: I wanted to go home.
: They took my groceries, my cookies.
: They took everything.
: Pushed me in there like a cattle.
: Terrible.
: From there they took me to durchgangslager, to Sosnowiec.
: It was a place where everybody had
: to go through this particular place in order
: to be transported to different camps.
: I was there three days.
: And then they sent me to Hansdorf camp.
: [SIGHS]
: This was still 1940?
: This was in 1941 that they captured me.
: 1941?
: Yes.
: 1941.
: I came to Hansdorf.
: They told us, if we're going to work very hard
: and produce what they want, they're
: going to let us home in six months.
: We're all going to go back home to our parents.
: They gave me one big machine, a spinnerei machine.
: It was maybe, like, seven feet long and maybe six feet high,
: with all the spools.
: I remember I had, like, 380 spools.
: We had to stay in the water.
: All those big spools were going to hot water.
: And we had the small spools.
: I worked so hard there.
: I couldn't wait for the day to go home to my parents,
: to my hometown.
: Every morning we got up.
: I don't know or It was 4 o'clock or 5 o'clock in the morning.
: I don't even know.
: [SIGHS] We had a bowl of watery soup.
: I remember one day we had some spinach there.
: It was so much dirt in it and so much coal in it
: that I could feel it in my teeth.
: That's what we had, with the little sliver of bread.
: And with this we marched to go to the factory.
: They were counting us before we went.
: They were counting us before we came back.
: It was awful.
: I was the only kid there.
: After working all those hours in the factory in the hot water,
: staying in the water, when we came back,
: I had to work, wash dishes, scrub the floors,
: help in the laundry.
: I couldn't wait to put my head down.
: We didn't even have anyplace where to put the head down,
: just the straw.
: And when I found a place, I had to lay down there
: and go to sleep.
: I was so exhausted.
: But when I was a minute too late,
: I never found the same place.
: I was sleeping everyplace, every night someplace else.
: In the morning we got up again, and we went to work.
: I was so good in it.
: I had to step down on the big stool
: because I couldn't reach the spools.
: So I've been going up and down, and those threads
: were cutting off every few seconds
: because of the hot water.
: But I tried to do so good.
: So they gave me two machines instead to send me home.
: I had one on the front, the one I had before,
: had another one on this side, right next to me.
: [SIGHS]
: One of the German people, she ate an apple.
: I could see her there eating that apple.
: My mouth was open.
: I couldn't-- I just couldn't wait to have a bite or a smell
: of it.
: And whatever she had left there, she threw it on the side,
: under the machine.
: I tried to pick that up and eat it.
: This SS woman beat me so bad.
: She took my head to the brick and beat
: me so hard and in my face, and she broke three teeth.
: I never swallowed a bite.
: I never had it in my mouth.
: The conditions over there were so terrible.
: The only thing what I can think is just
: to be home with my parents, and how long is it going to take,
: and when I'm going to be with them.
: And I was always hoping and believing
: that my mother and my father, they're going to live forever.
: They will never die.
: They just don't-- my parents would never die.
: I was just praying to the Almighty
: that one day maybe I'm going to be able to be after the war
: and see what's going to happen, just one hour
: and be back with them.
: And I really didn't care what I was doing, just
: to survive and be with my parents.
: But then on a Sunday, we worked at the farms and ranches
: and you name it, everything.
: Every Sunday we did something else.
: We worked seven days a week in the factory but Sunday.
: One Sunday they took us in--
: like 200 girls.
: And we went to a railroad station.
: Oh, I got--
: I got-- I made a mistake.
: That wasn't that.
: It was 75 girls.
: And we went to a railroad station.
: And the SS people say to us, I want everybody
: to get some pliers.
: The pliers were this big.
: They were so heavy.
: [CLEARS THROAT] And he said, I want eight girls
: to stay right there on this railroad and pick up,
: with those pliers, the rails.
: So I was standing with eight girls with the pliers, eight
: girls the next one.
: And he said, if we're going to count to three,
: I want you all to pick up the pliers and the rails.
: Well, we picked them up, and we took him right over there,
: whatever.
: Then we came back, and we picked up the next ones.
: It was so raining.
: It was pouring like with buckets.
: It was so dark.
: It's so cold, and we were so hungry.
: And we did all that.
: When we got through with that, we
: had to go back and pick up the same rails and bring them back.
: We lost so many girls there.
: A lot of them had terrible pain, stomach aches.
: They just couldn't do it.
: I couldn't do it myself, but I was afraid.
: If I'm going to drop it, they're going to kill me.
: If I'm going to turn around, they're going to kill me.
: And I had to survive.
: And we did that.
: And we were coming, and we brought the whole thing back,
: all those rails.
: Can you imagine?
: They were so heavy.
: Beside, the pliers were very heavy.
: Then we took them back again.
: And I could see that girls were falling down,
: and nobody went there to rescue them,
: no medication, no nothing.
: They were just laying there.
: I wanted to go and help one of the girls,
: and they told me don't try because they're
: going to kill you.
: And I wanted to live.
: I was afraid to go.
: By the time we got through with this, then we had to-- then
: it was only one rail left.
: In other words, one train could only go through it.
: And it was a train there with maybe 35 wagons or 34 wagons,
: with coal, gravel--
: very little coals.
: So they gave two girls to work on those wagons.
: I was there with this other girl, Zosia.
: And we had the two shovels.
: And this coal was so wet, and it was so heavy.
: So two of them went to each.
: Whoever-- we lost them before.
: We lost them, you know.
: But every two girls went into those wagons.
: And with these shovels, we had to take all the coal,
: like gravel, very, very little, you know, and they were so wet,
: and put them down on the ground.
: And this is what we did after we got through with the railroads,
: with the rags.
: By the time we got through doing that, we had to go--
: we went down from the wagons.
: It was so pitch dark, it was pouring so bad.
: We just didn't have the strength.
: We didn't even know what's going to happen
: and how long this is going to take.
: It just didn't make sense.
: We went down.
: We picked up the coal again, the gravel, the wet gravel.
: And we threw it on the wagons again, three, four times,
: or maybe more.
: I don't remember.
: I think I lost count.
: The while we went back, I could hear screaming.
: The girls were screaming from the front there.
: They kept saying a train is coming, and a train is coming.
: [SIGHS] Then we could see the lights on the locomotive,
: that the train was coming.
: But the train-- we were standing on this one--
: you know, what you might call--
: our train was standing on this--
: please, help me.
: Side rail?
: No, no, no.
: Landing?
: This-- the rail, the--
: The landing?
: No, the rail.
: The--
: Track?
: The track, yeah.
: We were standing on the track.
: So it was not-- it wasn't another track anymore
: for the other train to come.
: You know?
: And when we saw the other train, it was coming closer to us
: with the spotlights and lights and everything
: because we had only the open wagons, you know.
: And we heard all those screaming and everything.
: So some of the girls were screaming to the SS.
: And they said, listen, another train is coming.
: Can we go down?
: Can we go down?
: Can we go down?
: Please, help us to go down.
: Let us go down.
: He said that's the way it was planned,
: for you all to be killed.
: We planned it that way.
: There's no going down.
: Well, this train was coming, and it was a terrible tragedy.
: I had a dream right there.
: I could feel my mother, and my grandmother was pulling me.
: I could feel their hands on my shoulders.
: Don't cry.
: You're going to be all right.
: I could see those wagons were flying
: like leaves with all the girls.
: Only two of them survived from the 75 girls.
: One of them who survived, she lost her legs, her arms.
: Her head was crushed.
: She died later.
: And I was the other survivor, with broken ribs and broken
: legs, broken knees, and my arms.
: When I woke up, I was in the clinic with paper
: all around me.
: And the girl said to me, Ala, I feel so sorry for you.
: You would be so much better off with the rest of the girls
: instead to start working again here and starving,
: get all that beating every day before you went to the camp,
: to the factory, and coming back.
: I feel so sorry for you.
: But maybe you're lucky.
: I don't know how I survive.
: That was terrible.
: I need to rest a little bit.
: I really do.
: Can I?
: Would you like some water?
: Yeah.
: I really do.
: It's just-- this is still going on?
: It's OK.
: I just can't.
: I'm sick on my stomach.
: Thank you.
: How old were you by that time?
: I must have been 12 years old.
: So you had been there two years?
: Pretty close to two years.
: I was in two years.
: I was in a few other concentration camps.
: After that?
: After that I was in a few other concentration camp.
: I was in Neusalz concentration camp.
: Going from there, I was in Gross-Rosen.
: I was in a few other ones.
: I don't even remember the names because we
: didn't stay long enough there.
: But I was in Parschnitz two years, concentration camp.
: The first?
: Pardon me.
: That was the first?
: Last one.
: The last one?
: The last one.
: I don't know how I survived.
: I really don't know.
: I-- in Parschnitz, it was--
: it was just horrible.
: I remember, in Parschnitz, before the war was over,
: we thought it's going to be over or it is over because
: of the planes and everything.
: Everybody thought maybe it's over.
: Or it looks like it's over because the Germans were
: so nervous.
: They were riding the motorcycles and everything.
: And then they were so nervous.
: They baked-- over there, it was just terrible.
: I mean--
: Can you tell us the differences between the two camps?
: Oh, was a big difference.
: Over there we had to dig our own ditches, our own graves.
: They were hanging our people.
: They were counting every 10 people when we were--
: when we went out.
: In the morning they were counting us.
: And every 10th person, they took out from the line
: and sent them to the crematoriums.
: [SIGHS]
: Over there was just terrible.
: You didn't have any rest over there at all.
: We have to watch everybody.
: We have to watch them what they were doing,
: killing you, hanging you.
: We had to pick up the bodies.
: We had to dig our own graves.
: We didn't have anything over there.
: I must have weighed maybe 55 or 57 pounds, maybe 60.
: I don't even know.
: I was like a skeleton.
: One day I was the 10th person.
: And they picked me.
: And the SS walked over to me.
: Oh, he was maybe like four or five feet away from me.
: He wasn't too close to me.
: And he said, I want you to turn around here.
: He had all the people already lined up,
: the ones they already picked, the 10th one.
: He said, I want you to turn around,
: and I want you to see what is going on over here.
: See those people?
: They're praying to God.
: They're trying to kill themselves.
: They're trying to commit suicide.
: They're crying.
: How come you're not crying?
: How come you're so calm?
: I told him, I can't wait for you to kill me.
: I don't want to work for you anymore.
: I don't want to be your slave.
: And again, you took my parents and all that.
: I don't want to live.
: I'm going to die anyway.
: I don't want to live.
: I don't want to wait till I die.
: I want you to kill me right now.
: I'm glad you picked me.
: This saved my life.
: He said, you don't want to live, but you're going to live.
: And he pushed me back to a different line.
: So I survived again.
: And how old were you?
: I was 14 then.
: That was 19--
: '44.
: You know, '45, something like that.
: But you know, I kept asking all the time, myself, why?
: What did I do?
: Why do we have to be punished like this?
: I worked so hard there.
: Working hard didn't mean nothing.
: I think hate, what kept me going because I wanted to live
: and be with my parents so much.
: That whatever they did, and whatever I seen,
: what they did to the other people and to me,
: it looked like God gave me the strength-- maybe later,
: because I hated him in the beginning,
: because to see all that thing, and everything what I believe,
: the way I was raised--
: you know, my grandfather was a rabbi.
: My grandfather's father was a rabbi.
: I'm coming from such an Orthodox people.
: We used to go to Bais Yaakov.
: We used to learn.
: We used to teach.
: We used to believe in God.
: And here God is watching all that thing,
: cremating people, killing people.
: And he doesn't do anything about it?
: I was even angry at my parents because I believe in God.
: I thought the Almighty was--
: I mean, we got up in the morning.
: We didn't-- you know, my father went to the shul
: in the morning.
: We never put a piece of bread or challah
: in our mouth not to say a brokhe, you know,
: and to thank the God for the daily food.
: And I said where are you?
: Were you ever here?
: How can you watch all that and let all that thing happen?
: I said, show yourself.
: Do something.
: Please, do something.
: I mean, it took me years.
: I didn't believe in God.
: It was terrible.
: We were treated like animals there, just like animals.
: But I'd like to finish with something.
: I don't want to talk about this anymore.
: Because I had another tragedy.
: And I don't know I'm going to have enough time,
: but I would like to.
: We have quite a bit of time.
: Do you really?
: We have over an hour left.
: Yes.
: Oh, you do?
: Could you tell us a little bit about the network.
: Was there any network among the inmates, where you all
: helped each other?
: Well, I remember a few occasions when we came from the factory.
: And we had to stay in the line to--
: for the soup or whatever they're going to serve us.
: You know?
: I had an awful lot of pain in my stomach, you know, and my legs.
: But I tried to survive.
: And I started I tried to live, and I
: tried to do the best I could.
: They were very good to me.
: Some of them were very nice and good to me.
: Some of them-- they were hungry, and I was childish,
: and I trusted everybody.
: When I got this little piece of bread,
: I could have put it down, let's say, just
: for a split of a second, you know, and it was gone.
: Many times I stayed in the line for the soup, and by the time
: I got to the window there, they closed the window
: in the kitchen.
: They were out of the soup.
: So naturally, everybody was very angry, very mad,
: and very hungry.
: And they were not--
: we were not normal people there.
: Do you know what I'm saying?
: It was like a different life, without--
: all the time with the rifles and the machine guns, and people
: were watching us.
: And [SIGHS] the circumstances were so bad,
: and the dreams were so worse at night,
: screaming, hitting everybody.
: Can you tell us your dreams?
: I had terrible dreams, that they're
: killing my parents, my sisters, my brothers.
: I had dreams-- when I was digging those ditches,
: they said the enemy is coming and we have to hide.
: They have to hide us, so we need to dig those ditches.
: But they were not really ditches to be dig for us.
: We were digging our own graves.
: Most of those people were killed.
: I had terrible dreams about it.
: I used to get up, like, 3, 4 o'clock in the morning
: to go back to work.
: And I was with my parents sometimes,
: with my sisters sometimes in my dreams.
: And they helped me to keep going.
: I had so much hope because of them.
: But I had very bad dreams.
: I used to scream at nights all the time.
: I used to help my husband with his dreams.
: He used to wake me up, too, all the time at night
: and turn the lights on.
: This was after the war?
: I'm sorry, I'm getting very off the racket.
: I'm sorry.
: I'm really sorry.
: Yeah, I had terrible dreams there.
: But most of the girls there, they were pretty nice.
: They tried to help each other.
: But a lot of them, they were not so nice to the young girls.
: They took a lot of advantage of you, you know.
: I would say they were maybe 25, 28, 30-something years old.
: Some of them were already married.
: And here you have a young girl or two
: or three other young girls.
: They were always pushing you around, you know.
: But most of the times they were OK, you know.
: Like, they took-- I didn't have any soup,
: somebody shared what theirs--
: what they had with me, which this was nice.
: And they didn't have too much.
: But I don't know.
: I have so much to talk about that I just can't think
: of too many things right now.
: Who liberated you?
: The Russian people, in Parschnitz.
: Tell us about that.
: Yeah.
: I was standing by the window over there, in the barracks.
: A couple of days before, a big transport
: came in from Hungary, or maybe four days before.
: What camp was it?
: This was Parschnitz concentration camp.
: And we had those little windows there.
: And a big transport came in from Budapest,
: from Hungary, beautiful people with beautiful long hair.
: By the way, I didn't have any hair.
: They cut my hair.
: Everybody's hair was cut off.
: And they came in.
: The music started playing.
: The women were singing.
: And we knew right away what's going
: to happen to them, beautiful people,
: all dressed up so nice with jewelry and everything.
: They didn't take long.
: They took their clothes.
: They cut their hair.
: They put everything on a pile, took their jewelry,
: threw it on a pile.
: I don't know from where they came from.
: I knew they were from Budapest.
: They were born in Budapest.
: But I don't know from where they came from.
: They came-- they must have come from someplace, hidden place
: or something because they had clothes on.
: They didn't wear like we did.
: You know what I'm saying?
: But some of the girls said that they were
: born in Budapest, in Hungary.
: Some of them, they had such beautiful long hair.
: They must have taken maybe 200 or 300 of them.
: It must be like maybe 500 altogether.
: 300 of them, they cut their hair and took everything away.
: And they took them away.
: In the morning, said for us to go to work.
: [SOBS] We had to clean up their bodies.
: We had to put them all on a pile.
: [CRYING] And we had to do it.
: Little did I--
: I don't know how we could survive.
: I just don't know.
: Two days later--
: I don't remember, too--
: I told you about the bread or not.
: Did I?
: What about the bread?
: They announced on the loudspeaker,
: said they're baking some bread.
: And anybody will come, they can get
: a loaf of bread, a whole loaf of bread.
: Can you imagine a whole loaf of bread to get in one time?
: The people were running like crazy.
: They were so wild.
: Oh.
: They were running.
: They were chasing.
: They were fighting.
: Everybody wanted to be free to get this loaf of bread.
: I didn't have the strength.
: I wanted to have the loaf of bread too.
: I didn't have the strength to go.
: I tried to crawl.
: I just didn't have the strength.
: A few hours later, we found out that they
: poison all that bread.
: We lost a lot of people, a lot of them.
: Then, I think the next day, we saw a woman on a bicycle.
: She was wearing a brown uniform.
: And she had two machine guns, or two revolvers.
: And she told the Germans by the gate to open the gate.
: They wouldn't open the gate.
: We was wondering who the person was.
: And then we knew, said this is going to be the end of us.
: I mean, this is it.
: They wouldn't open the big black gate.
: She shot him.
: And other SS men came, and they opened the gate.
: She drove in on this bicycle.
: And after her, we were so hysterical,
: screaming, only what we saw, the people behind her.
: We could see those big trucks, and playing
: the harmonicas, as many--
: but we didn't know they were Russian people.
: They were the Russian people.
: She must have been the patrol or whatever.
: We never seen anything like this in our life.
: But we didn't care later on who it was, you know.
: But in the beginning, we didn't know.
: That woman by herself, a young woman, you know?
: And then we could see, you know, through the window.
: You know, I could look at it, and a few others look out,
: you know.
: But at that time, we really didn't care.
: We didn't go to the factory or anything, you know.
: And when they came in with those harmonica playing
: and with food, a lot of our girls lost their mind.
: I was so hysterical, I was screaming.
: I could see the end.
: This is it.
: And we didn't know who those people were.
: We were so scared.
: But then we found out that they were-- the rest,
: they took care of the Germans, you know.
: And we found out that they were the Russian people.
: So they took really good care of us.
: They really did.
: They were very nice to us.
: The Red Cross was very nice to us.
: They took off all my papers.
: I had a lot of papers.
: I had papers wrapped around here for my, you know, ribs.
: And they put bandages on me and everything, you know.
: But I was--
: I was so much better.
: And they brought a lot of food, but nobody could eat the food.
: And they took everybody to hospitals.
: And that was the place where I was six months.
: I was six and a half months in a hospital.
: Where was that?
: I was in Saint Ottilien.
: Is that still in Poland?
: No.
: No.
: No.
: In Germany.
: I was in St. Ottilien.
: And this was 1945?
: Yes.
: That was the time when she came in, was just right
: there after the bread.
: We lost so many people eating this bread.
: Poor little girls, they were so hungry.
: I was so lucky that day too, very lucky.
: They took the people to the hospitals.
: They took care of all those Germans.
: But we had a very hard struggle, those lives,
: watching everybody killing like this
: and hanging them and punishing them and hitting them
: for no reason.
: I just hope and pray to the Almighty
: that we will never forget what happened.
: And I hope and pray that everybody
: will know what happened to us so it won't happen again.
: Was just a terrible thing.
: A lot of people here, they just taking a lot of things for
: granted.
: They just don't understand how precious the United States is
: and what a wonderful country it is, really.
: A lot of them don't appreciate this.
: But we do.
: We know everything about human beings.
: We know everything about the people.
: We know everything about how life is important.
: Life is so precious.
: When you're losing this, you lost everything.
: You don't have nothing what to live for.
: But I'd like to say something.
: Besides this tragedy, when I was 10 years
: old in the concentration camps, I don't know,
: but I had another tragedy.
: You're talking about more recent in your life?
: Yes.
: Can we just get the--
: what happened between the hospital up until the tragedy?
: Can you tell us where you went from the hospital
: and how you got to the United States?
: From the hospital-- from the hospital,
: my sister survived, Gene.
: I have two sisters that survived.
: Gene Pfeffer-Moss, she lives in Jerusalem.
: She used to live here in Dallas, and she was a teacher here
: in Shearith Israel.
: And she lived here.
: Oh, no, my sister--
: my sister took me to the--
: my sister found out that I was in St. Ottilien in a hospital.
: And she lived in Stuttgart, in Germany.
: And she found a place there.
: And I stayed with her for a little while,
: but I was in the hospital six and a half months.
: Well, the Dr. Greenberg, he told me
: that I need to go to Karlovy Vary, which
: is Carlsbad for my ulcer and for my treatments
: and different things.
: So I was there two and a half months
: I think, or pretty close to three months,
: also hitchhiking on a train going there
: because I didn't have any money or anything, you know.
: And when I came back from there, back to Stuttgart,
: my sister was already in the United States.
: She wrote to me, but I couldn't get her correspondence at all
: to Russia, because in Karlovy Vary,
: the Russian people were there.
: And she couldn't get my letters, and I couldn't get her letters.
: So by the time I got back to Stuttgart, she wrote me.
: She left me a big letter and pictures how sad she was,
: but she had to do it because her husband found
: a brother in Florida.
: And this was the date when they had to leave,
: and they couldn't wait any longer.
: And they were waiting for me to come,
: said I was on the same affidavit to go with them,
: but they couldn't contact me.
: They couldn't get in touch with me.
: So they were here, and I was there by myself, in Stuttgart.
: And then, what happened after?
: That I met my husband.
: In Stuttgart?
: Mhm.
: Tell us about that.
: Well, when I was a young child--
: maybe I was maybe about six and a half or maybe seven
: by that time.
: I went with two ladies and eight girls.
: We were supposed to go to have fun and go swimming.

: Everybody to hospitals, and that was the place
: where I was six months, six and a half months in a hospital.
: Where was that?
: I was in St. Ottilien.
: Is that still in Poland?
: No, no, no, in Germany.
: I was in St. Ottilien.
: And this was 1945?
: Yes, that was the time when she came in,
: was just right there after the bread.
: We lost so many people eating this bread.
: Poor little girls.
: They were so hungry.
: I was so lucky that day, too.
: Very lucky.
: They took the people to the hospitals,
: they took care of all those Germans.
: But we had a very hard struggle, those lives, watching
: everybody killing like this.
: And hanging them, and punishing them,
: and hitting them for no reason.
: I just hope and pray to the Almighty
: that we will never forget what happened.
: And I hope and pray that everybody
: will know what happened to us, so it won't happen again.
: Because that's a terrible thing.
: A lot of people here, they just taking a lot of things for
: granted--
: they just don't understand how precious the United States is,
: and what a wonderful country it is, really.
: A lot of them don't appreciate this.
: But we do.
: We know everything about human beings--
: we know everything about the people.
: We know everything about how life is important.
: Life is so precious.
: When you're losing this, you lost everything.
: You don't have nothing what to live for.
: But I'd like to say something--
: beside this tragedy, when I was 10 years
: old in the concentration camps, I don't know,
: but I had another tragedy.
: You're talking about more recent in your life?
: Yes.
: Can we just get to what happened between the hospital up
: until the tragedy?
: Can you tell us where you went from the hospital,
: and how you got to the United States?
: From the hospital-- from the hospital, my sister survived,
: Gean--
: I have two sisters that survived--
: Gean Pfeffer-Moss, she lives in Jerusalem,
: she used to live here in Dallas, and she was a teacher here
: in Shearith Israel.
: And she lived here--
: no, my sister-- my sister took me to the--
: my sister found out that I was in St. Ottilien hospital.
: And she lived in Stuttgart, in Germany.
: And she found a place there, and I stayed with her
: for a little while.
: But I was in the hospital six and a half months.
: With a Dr. Greenberg, he told me that I
: need to go to Karlovy Vary, which is Karlsbad, for my ulcer
: and for my treatments and different things.
: So I was there two and a half months, I think,
: or pretty close to three months.
: Also hitchhiking on a train, going there,
: because I didn't have any money, or anything, you know.
: And when I came back from there back to Stuttgart,
: my sister was already in the United States.
: She wrote to me, but I couldn't get her correspondence at all
: to Russia, because in Karlovy Vary,
: the Russian people were there.
: And she couldn't get my letters, and I couldn't get her letters.
: So by the time I got back to Stuttgart, she wrote me--
: she left me a big letters and pictures how sad she was,
: but she had to do it.
: Because her husband found a brother in Florida,
: and this was the date when they had to leave.
: And they couldn't wait any longer.
: And they were waiting for me to come.
: So I was on the same affidavit to go with them,
: but they couldn't contact me, they
: couldn't get in touch with me.
: So they were here, and I was there by myself in Stuttgart.
: And then?
: What happened after?
: That I met my husband.
: In Stuttgart?
: Mm-hmm.
: Tell us about that.
: Well, when I was a young child, maybe
: I was maybe about six and half, or maybe seven by that time,
: I went with two ladies and eight girls--
: we were supposed to go to have fun and go swimming.
: My mother fixed me the lunch bag, and we went there.
: So those ladies said to us, now, listen,
: what I'm going to do right now is to hire a big kayak.
: Do you know what a kayak is?
: OK, I'm going to take a kayak, and I'm
: going to take two girls across, and you wait here.
: So she did.
: When she went there with all the girls, you know, two of them
: were behind, but it was another girl and me.
: And we were waiting, and waiting, and waiting,
: and waiting.
: And meantime, I need to go to the bathroom.
: And I was hungry, and I wanted to eat, too.
: I didn't have the patience anymore.
: So Rubin had a white and a blue kayak--
: my husband-- and he was such a good-looking man,
: and young boy, and everything.
: And while he was close to us, I asked him
: he just can take us just across.
: And he said, he'd like that.
: And he asked this lady he was with, is it OK?
: And he said, OK.
: So she took this little girl, and I was there by myself.
: And he said, all right, I'm going to take her, come
: back, and take you.
: So by the time he came, picked me up,
: well, I walked in, in the kayak, and I was very happy
: just to be across there so I can start eating.
: And I wanted to go to the bathroom, too.
: Well, he put me in the kayak there,
: and he start shaking the kayak.
: And I can't swim.
: Now, all my sisters could swim.
: I couldn't swim.
: And I fell in the water.
: And I hated him for it.
: When somebody rescued me, and took me out,
: and naturally my lunch was wet-- the whole thing was wet,
: my clothes was wet.
: And this lady-- and he took me, I was across,
: and this lady was very angry at me
: because we didn't wait for her, you know.
: Then when I came home with them, I was punished from my parents
: by doing that, and not to be together with those ladies.
: And the second time when I saw Rubin was in Stuttgart.
: And you were how old?
: When I saw him?
: 17.
: How did you live in Stuttgart?
: How did you live in Stuttgart?
: I mean, how did you-- did you work?
: Well, I wasn't really too long in Stuttgart,
: because I was in Karlovy Vary, I told you,
: you know, in this clinic there.
: After I left St. Ottilien hospital,
: and I gained weight and everything.
: I looked pretty good.
: I was very sick in the hospital-- they were feeding
: me intravenous all the time.
: I was very sick girl.
: In Stuttgart, the UNRRA was taking care of us.
: And no, I didn't work.
: The UNRRA was taking care of us.
: And we were just displaced people, you know.
: I didn't work.
: My sister was already here.
: And I remember one thing what I had was the army blanket--
: you know from the army?
: Those green blankets.
: I met a man over there in Stuttgart, and he was a tailor.
: Or he knew a little bit about tailoring, whatever.
: And I asked him, if he could make a coat for me
: from this blanket.
: And he did.
: And I want you to know, I have a picture from it,
: it's a beautiful coat.
: But I hated it because it was itching me
: like I will have the measles all the time.
: But I really loved it, because it kept me warm.
: But I didn't do anything in Stuttgart.
: But while I was there, I found out that my other sister,
: Tema] survived.
: They called me in Stuttgart, from the UNRRA,
: to their office.
: You know the UNRRA is, don't you?
: Or you heard about it?
: The American--
: OK, and they said, listen, I have very good news
: to tell you.
: I heard that your sister is alive in Stockholm.
: She was in a hospital, but she's alive.
: She's doing fine.
: And I said to this man, how do you
: know that this is my sister?
: So he said, well, her name is Tema
: and she was with her younger sister, Zosia,
: in Bergen-Belsen.
: And so she lost her life, which is my other sister.
: But Tema survived.
: Tema was the one who sent me care packages,
: you know, all the fish and sardines from Scandinavia,
: from Sweden.
: She was in Stockholm.
: Then she was in Malmo.
: So I remember-- but I didn't work.
: But one day, Rubin, my husband, he used to live-- he
: was in Garmisch-Partenkirchen.
: And he was a furrier, and he did extremely well at that time,
: in Germany.
: Had he been in the camps?
: Pardon me?
: Had he been in the camps?
: Yes, he was in the camp, too.
: But I'm talking about right after the war.
: He and Mark Tambourine, which they were two partners,
: and they went in the fur business.
: Now Mark is now--
: maybe I shouldn't say it, but he's a much older man,
: you know, he was in the fur business before the war.
: Now, Rubin.
: Wasn't he was just a young boy.
: So they were in the fur business,
: and they did very well.
: And when Rubin came to Stuttgart, I remember,
: I took some of those packages from my sister, from Tema,
: and I sold them.
: Because I heard so much about Rigoletto
: the opera, and I wanted to go and see it.
: I'd never been to one.
: I was so anxious to go, but I didn't have any money.
: So I sold this care package-- the package what she gave me.
: But the tickets were still expensive, then, you know.
: And Rubin arrived to Stuttgart then, and he had a flat tire.
: While he was there, everybody on the Reisburgstraße--
: Reisburger street, in Stuttgart, were surrounded there,
: looking at him.
: He was a very handsome man, driving a BMW, nine-passengers.
: And he had his own chauffeur.
: And he did extremely well.
: And everybody-- they saw me, they
: wanted-- they kept telling me, Ala, you never seen anybody
: in your life so good-looking in a beautiful car,
: and a chauffeur.
: I want you to go meet him.
: We all met him here this morning.
: And I said, oh, I have to go and get those tickets
: to go see Rigoletto.
: And I didn't go to see him.
: I wanted to stay in the line, pick up those tickets.
: I wasn't interested.
: Then, the next day, I said, maybe
: I'm going to see him the next day
: when he's going to be there.
: Well, he was still there.
: And Regina, which she's dead now,
: that's my sister-in-law's sister,
: she was crazy about him.
: And she kept saying to me, Ala, you have to go and see him.
: You have to meet him.
: I invited him to have dinner with us--
: Regina.
: So then, I went to meet him.
: I already had my tickets.
: And looking at him, I could tell by his eyes that I know him,
: but I couldn't place him right at first.
: And then, we start talking.
: And he kept saying to me, you know,
: I can't understand-- everybody came to see me yesterday,
: and today, and this morning.
: And you try to avoid me all the time.
: I told him, I didn't, I just didn't care.
: You know, I wanted to go and get those tickets, you know.
: While he was doing all that talking,
: I said to myself, oh, my.
: I said, this is the man what I--
: I think that's-- no, that couldn't be.
: But more I looked at him, he looked the same way,
: you know, with those beautiful eyes, you know, and all that.
: So I said to him, did you have a kayak, white and blue?
: His face was so red.
: And he said, yes.
: I said, you the one did the dirty trick to me, did you?
: And he said, you didn't want to--
: so that's the way we started.
: And we married in 1947, from all the girls what he had.
: In Germany?
: In Germany.
: And I moved to Stuttgart--
: I mean, to Garmisch-Partenkirchen,
: which we had the factory and fur salon in Garmisch.
: What was life like there?
: Life-- in Garmisch, I wasn't by myself.
: I was with my husband.
: I was with a lot of people, a lot of survivors.
: But I loved my husband.
: And he was such a good man.
: He was so good to everybody.
: He helped everybody.
: Everybody liked him.
: Then, he was the president from the federation there--
: not federation, family service, whatever, you know.
: There was no federation, I don't think-- community center,
: or whatever, you know.
: Everybody just loved him.
: Our home was an open house for everybody.
: And by the way, we lived in Eva Braun's villa,
: I want you to know.
: Which was Hitler's.
: What was that like for you, to know that?
: Well, when I moved in there, with Marian and Freja--
: Freja already lived there, and Marian--
: I hate everything about it.
: Everything I-- what can I tell you?
: I hated it.
: I'm sorry, who are Marian and Freja?
: Marian is the partner was with my husband,
: I mentioned that before.
: Yeah.
: The villa was-- consists of 28 rooms.
: We had-- upstairs, we had a big kitchen,
: we had a big kitchen downstairs.
: I think-- not that I think, but all the paintings,
: and the chandeliers, and the crystals, and the silver,
: I think and I feel still that everything
: belonged to our people.
: We lived in this place because it was convenient.
: We helped a lot of people that came
: from different places that were handicapped,
: they looked for jobs.
: And this was the place for them.
: So we put beds there, and accommodate them
: with everything, what everybody needed.
: Was the biggest place in Garmisch.
: And my husband was very pleased with it,
: so he could help somebody.
: So you took people in?
: Oh, we had a lot of people all the time.
: All the time.
: We helped them with jobs, but they stayed with us.
: We were cooking-- was like an open house for everybody.
: You didn't have to have an invitation.
: It wasn't because it was Eva Braun's house,
: it was a shelter for people that needed it.
: Where to sleep, where to stay, not to be in the gutter,
: not to be on the streets.
: But at night, was very rough, because the chandeliers,
: and the crystals, and--
: they woke me up.
: I had terrible dreams about them all the time.
: What were your dreams like?
: The sirens-- pardon me?
: What were your dreams like during that period?
: Only about my family, and about the people
: what I went through, all this time.
: All the killings, what I could see--
: all the carrying the bodies, people.
: What I was so close with them, people what I tried to help.
: People what they were so dear to me.
: They were just human beings.
: I just couldn't believe--
: I thought it was a dream.
: I just couldn't believe that this was
: reality what we went through.
: With all that thing.
: I just-- it was just hard to believe.
: After the war, it took me a while to--
: I just couldn't believe myself what I went through.
: And how I survive, going through all that.
: Was terrible.
: But then, I had a son in 1948.
: I brought my little son to the world.
: I didn't believe that I'm going to be
: able to have a baby, because while we were
: in the concentration camp, they also put food in the soups,
: so the women would not have any periods.
: By that time, I didn't have mine in the beginning.
: So I didn't worry too much about it.
: But I had a big problem later on,
: when I was pregnant with my son.
: What was the problem?
: Well, I was pregnant, and I had a miscarriage.
: Then I had another miscarriage.
: Then finally, the doctor told me to go ahead and give it
: another try.
: And this was really the thing, because of that soup,
: what they put the medication or whatever they did, you know,
: so nobody had the period, the girls, they didn't-- the women,
: I know they didn't.
: But then God was good to me later on, and he gave me a son.
: What were your thoughts about being
: able to have a child after what you had been through?
: I was just thrilled.
: You know, that was a moment where I really
: start to believe back in God a little bit.
: Not much, just a little bit.
: Because I was praying to God, I was
: praying that he's going to keep an eye on me
: and give me a healthy baby this time.
: I was really--
: I almost believed that he's going
: to do that before I had my son.
: But for a while, I really lost faith.
: I really did.
: And I don't know if it's normal, or not, but I did.
: I just couldn't believe.
: If we had a God, and you see all those things what is going
: on to the people, and he cannot stop or show miracles the way
: we were taught he can do, I lost faith in him.
: But when my son, Joseph, was born, I was a different person.
: It meant so much to me.
: The whole world was different.
: My husband was so happy, I was so happy.
: I was just praying, I wish my parents would be here and see
: the first grandchild, which they had one before,
: and they lost it-- my sister's baby.
: I didn't want to bring it up, because it's very painful.
: But what we came here--
: Can you tell us now?
: Or is that too hard to talk about?
: I can't talk about it.
: Well, my sister, Jean, OK?
: My sister Jean was married to a criminal lawyer.
: She's the one who is in Jerusalem.
: She was a very educated lady, and she still is.
: She's teaching in Uppsala--
: she speaks a few languages.
: She's the one was the teacher here
: in Sherith Israel in Dallas.
: Her husband was a criminal lawyer.
: They were very well off.
: They had a six-month baby, baby girl.
: They sent her to the concentration camp.
: They sent her husband, also, they
: sent him to the crematorium.
: And they took the baby.
: I can't say it.
: They killed her baby.
: They threw the baby out through the window.
: I can't say it.
: She was six months old.
: Such an innocent, little baby.
: I have the little one's picture here, too.
: I'm going to tell you one thing, it's
: going to take us another 10 years to tell everything,
: or more.
: Do I have more time?
: You want to tell us, after your son was born,
: and bring us up to date in your life?
: Thank you.
: We came to the United States here in 1949, July 4th,
: Independence Day, with my husband,
: with my little baby boy, Joseph Bernard.
: So happy and so proud.
: The first thing what happened to us when we arrived
: to New York, my husband--
: I asked my husband to bring me a little bottle of water
: for the baby.
: I was nursing the baby because I didn't know how long we
: were going to be on the boat.
: Then, we had to take the train to go to the house.
: So I had the most beautiful silver fox long cape.
: I put it on the bench in New York, on the station.
: And my husband had a most beautiful fur coat, lined--
: the furs, you know, fur lining.
: And he put it on the same bench.
: And he went to get the water.
: I was changing the baby's diaper.
: It took a split of a second, all those two pieces were gone.
: His coat, oh, yeah, his coat, and the hat, and my cape.
: This was our first experience in the United States.
: But we came to Dallas.
: My husband had already a job at Neiman Marcus, which
: they knew that Rubin is coming.
: So he was a furrier and a designer for them.
: Couldn't speak English.
: But he was a wonderful craftsman,
: and a very good taste.
: So he was with Neiman's 11 years.
: Then he was associated with Szor--
: Sam Szor.
: I don't remember, it was maybe two or three years.
: Then he finally went back on his own,
: in his own business, which the name was Fine Furs by Rubin.
: Did you have more children?
: I have two more children.
: I have another-- I have a daughter, RoseAnn.
: And then I have a son, David J. And I'm so proud of them.
: That's the only thing what I have right now,
: is my beautiful children.
: And I have two grandchildren.
: We had this place, Fine Furs by Rubin.
: And we were so happy, we were such a happy family.
: We used to go on walk, and hold hands, my husband and I,
: and just like two little kids.
: Just happy.
: And I used to help my husband in the fur business.
: But in 1980, I had a terrible tragedy.
: We went to Europe.
: And we came back from Europe, we had such a wonderful time.
: We went to Israel, we went to Paris, we went to Italy,
: we've been going for two and a half months.
: I have to have a little water.
: [DRINKS]
: We came back from Europe on a Sunday night.
: Monday, my husband opened the business.
: Tuesday morning, around noon, two Black girls
: walked in, in our shop.
: I was there, too, calling people from storage and the showroom.
: They walked in like two customers.
: They robbed us.
: They took everything from our store,
: and they killed my husband in cold blood.
: They shot at me.
: And I lost my husband then.
: That was really the end of everything.
: But one thing he gave me was a wonderful name,
: and beautiful children to be proud of.
: And beautiful memories.
: And I don't want to talk anymore.
: I really don't.
: I'd like to, but I can't.
: Is there anything else you want to say?
: Anything out of all of this that matters, that you think
: is important to say?
: I just hope and pray to the Almighty
: that whoever listens to me believes
: what I'm saying, because it is nothing but the truth.
: I wish I can keep going, but I just can't.
: I'm only human.
: It would take me really years to talk what I went through.
: And I'm choking.
: I'm trying not to show it.
: But I hope for everybody not to forget,
: and not ever, ever forgive to anybody what they did to us.
: And to remember one thing--
: said, I don't want to live for the Holocaust.
: I want to give my life to the livings--
: not for the Holocaust.
: Thank you.
: Thank you.

Overview

Interviewee: Ala Danziger
Interviewer: James Pennebaker
Alan Griffin
Date: interview: 1985 December 14

Physical Details

Language: English
Extent: 2 videocassettes (VHS) : sound, color ; 1/2 in..

Rights & Restrictions

Conditions on Access: There are no known restrictions on access to this material.
Conditions on Use: No restrictions on use

Keywords & Subjects

Topical Term: Holocaust, Jewish (1939-1945)--Europe--Personal narratives.
Personal Name: Danziger, Ala.

Administrative Notes

Holder of Originals: Dallas Holocaust Museum, Center for Education and Tolerance
Legal Status: Permanent Collection
Provenance: James Pennebaker and Alan Griffin of the Dallas Memorial Center for Holocaust Studies conducted the interview with Ala Danziger on December 14, 1985. The United States Holocaust Memorial Museum Oral History branch received the tapes of the interview from the Dallas Memorial Center for Holocaust Studies on July 17, 1991. The United States Holocaust Memorial Museum Archives received the interview by transfer from the Oral History branch in February 1995.
Special Collection: The Jeff and Toby Herr Oral History Archive

Record last modified:: 2023-11-16 08:08:59
This page:: http://collections.ushmm.org/search/catalog/irn506594

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Also in Oral history interviews of the Dallas Memorial Center for Holocaust Studies

Contains interviews with 31 Holocaust survivors in the Dallas, TX area

Date: 1985-1992

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Helen Biderman (née Prengler), born April 21, 1928 in Luków, Poland, describes her four brothers; her parents; growing up in Poland; the chaos of the beginning of the war; the roundup of Jews by the German Army on October 5 and the subsequent execution near a church; the deportations from Luków; going with her family to a nearby town; being forced to live with several families; the winter of 1940; her parents hiding while she stayed with an aunt; being moved to a ghetto with the other Jews; hiding with her family in an underground space during the deportations; being discovered by a Polish fireman hiding in various places; staying for seven to eight weeks in her grandfather's underground bunker with 17 members of her family; hiding with a German woman who owned a brick factory; being found by the Germans and the death of her younger brother; life in the ghetto from the end of 1942 to May 2, 1943; the attempt by some Jews to form a resistance group; falling ill with typhus; being attacked by a German Shepherd; hiding outside the ghetto; her parents reopening their business and staying until April 1945; moving to Katowice, Poland for a year then going to Munich, Germany for three years; her family getting papers to move to the United States; getting married and living in New Orleans, LA; how the Holocaust brought her family closer together; and her feelings about Germans.

Oral history interview with Max Biderman

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Max Biderman, born February 11, 1917 in Luków, Poland, describes his family; growing up in Poland; the beginning of the war; his family hiding during the roundups; the execution of Jews by the German Army; being caught with two of his brothers and forced to walk to Siedlce, Poland, where they were put in jail; being marched to a town 20 kilometers away and escaping with one of his brothers; returning home and hearing of the deportations to Treblinka; the creation of a ghetto in 1942 during the New Year; hiding during a deportation and the death of one of his brothers; living in the ghetto; working in a German factory; avoiding another deportation by hiding in the woods; contracting typhoid; witnessing the shooting of one of his brothers; being hidden by a Polish couple; hiding with several other Jewish boys; being hidden by a Polish farmer named Bronkevitch; defending themselves against a group of 40 armed men (possibly the Armia Krajowa); hiding in the forest; his group taking revenge on a farmer who denounced hidden Jews; reading newspapers; the arrival of the Russian Army; returning to Luków; finding the Prengler family (he later married Helen Prengler, RG-50.045*0001); going to Brest-Litovsk (Brześć Litewski), Poland after the war; going to Katowice, Poland then Munich, Germany; immigrating to the United States in September 1949; his children and grandchildren; not sharing his story with his children until recently; visiting Poland in 1984 and showing his children where he hid; the importance and danger of having a gun during the occupation; and testifying against a war criminal.

Oral history interview with Martin Donald

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Oral history interview with Bela Einhorn

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Oral history interview with Marie Fauss

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Marie Fauss (née Lucet Marie Selek), born August 25, 1925 at Pont-à-Mousson, France, describes her Catholic mother and Jewish father; visiting the synagogue with her father when she was four years old; her education; beginning college when she was 12 years old; her father reading Mein Kampf and warning her of Hitler’s intentions; her family’s Jewish and Catholic friends; her father deciding she should attend Catholic church; the invasion of Poland; the scarcity of coal; being out of college in July 1940; being warned by an Italian of the impending invasion; her fear of the Germans; fleeing with an Italian family south on minor roads; seeing an exodus of people moving south as they arrive in Nancy, France; being in Nancy during a bombardment; the German restrictions during the occupation; the taking of a census; the round ups and deportations; rumors about concentration camps; taking in other refugees; collaborators; becoming silent and withdrawn; being required to take German at school; being interrogated six times and having their house searched by the Germans; being beaten by interrogators; her belief that the mayor betrayed her to the Germans; being told to report to the town square to be sent to a work camp; being taken to a farm that produced food for a concentration camp in Lorraine; being taken out of the camp after three months with the help of her father; contracting tuberculosis; the arrival of American troops in September 1944; the Germans burning the college and hospital; how the war affected her; and getting married in 1945.

Oral history interview with Max Glauben

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Oral history interview with Bela Goldberg

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Oral history interview with Henry Goldberg

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Oral history interview with Alli Itzkowitz

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Oral history interview with Mike Jacobs

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Oral history interview with Miriam Joseph

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Oral history interview with Abram Kozolchyk

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Oral history interview with Leo Laufer

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Oral history interview with Helen Neuberg

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Helen Neuberg (née Chaja Miemacher), born December 12, 1926 in Ostrowice, Poland (possibly Ostrowiec in powiat sokołowski), describes her Orthodox family; growing up Jewish and her interactions with Gentiles; the German invasion; the restrictions placed on Jews; people being killed for breaking the curfew; her experiences in the ghetto; hiding during the deportation of her family, all of whom perished in Treblinka; witnessing acts of brutality and cruelty; obtaining false papers; moving to Warsaw, Poland; finding work as a waitress in Stuttgart, Germany, where she lived in fear of discovery; being aided by a Jewish American solider after the war, who assisted her in finding relatives in North America; meeting her husband, who was a survivor of concentration camps, in a displaced persons camp; and immigrating to the United States with her child and husband.